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The situation in France, as seen by Tiberge
I wrote to Tiberge at Galliawatch:
I have not be able to keep with events in France. I saw vaguely there were riots, but have not followed it. Would you like to write for VFR a summary of the recent developments, maybe linking your previous postings on this and tying them together?
Tiberge replied:
I’ll try, but it’s been a wild two weeks. There have been dozens and dozens of pro-Hamas “demonstrations” throughout France and Europe. There was a pro-Hitler demo in Copenhagen. Downtown Nice was torn apart last Saturday. There were anti-Jewish slogans, banners all over France and Europe. Hatred like I’ve never seen before. But most of the demonstrators were a coalition of the left and the Muslims. The Right stayed out of it.
A Catholic Cardinal said that Gaza was a concentration camp, and Le Pen agreed with that. But a NY Post article by Ralph Peters, saying that most of those killed in Gaza were not civilians but Hamas members, was translated into French and published at many French websites.
In France there is still bitterness and deep resentment on the part of the Right towards the Jews, as they are being held responsible for the immigration of Muslims. I’ve exhausted all the arguments I know of with my readers in an attempt to show them that Jews aren’t the only ones responsible. But it’s like talking to a wall. Most French politicians insist that events in Gaza have nothing whatsoever to do with France, and that the war must not be imported into France. As they speak, pro-Hamas riots are breaking out all over France. I’ve tried to tell readers that whether they like it or not, they are involved, but they insist they don’t care about Israel, they just want to get rid of the Muslims.
The Jews, however, do have their share of responsibility. The rabbis in France, and now Italy, all welcome mosques and minarets. A rabbi in Florence just said he welcomes a minaret, because you “can’t pray in a garage.” It goes on and on like this. A Jewish-Muslim organization in France promotes friendship between the two groups and inter-racial metissage! The French Right hates the Jews for this more than they hate the Muslims. Sometimes I think they expected more from the Jews and they feel betrayed. Then the older paleo-anti-Semites like Le Pen get going and win over a lot of angry people to their side. Did you know that Le Pen attended Dieudonne’s latest “show” in Paris, where Holocaust revisionist Robert Faurisson was invited onto the stage to present his views? It made headlines all over France. Many cities then banned Dieudonne’s tour.
Here is my rather prolix editorial on the “Jewish-Muslim friendship bus,” with a photo. (There is an update to this story: the Muslims have withdrawn from the group on grounds that the Jews were not critical of Israeli actions in Gaza. This is fine with me. But will the Jews learn a lesson, or will they continue to pursue an unrealizable dream of equality?)
The crux of the problem is that the French Right perceives that French Jews advocate for France things that they would never advocate for Israel. Metissage, for example. They see that while the Jews in France seem to welcome a Muslim presence, they also display a strong patriotic sentiment for Israel, so they appear to be destroying France with one set of values on the one hand, and fighting for Israel using another set of values, on the other.
However, Sarkozy is the worst. This is from my article about him:
Many websites are talking about Nicolas Sarkozy’s speech, delivered on Wednesday in Orleans, in which he condemned equally anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. This is not the first time he has done this, nor is he the only one to do it. It is the basic non-discrimination policy of the European Union—all discriminations are equally bad.
In the 60’s they said, “It is forbidden to forbid.”
Now they are saying, “It is discrimination, punishable by fines and prison sentences, to discriminate one type of behavior from another.” So, there are no differences between behaviors. If there are no differences between behaviors, then self-defense and first-degree murder are identical. Self-preservation and racism are equally bad. The unjustifiable desire to eradicate Jews from the earth is equal to the justifiable urgency to stop Islamic immigration and the Islamization of France. And so a Frenchman who wants to save his country from massive immigration becomes a racist. This is pure political blackmail.
Sarkozy also said:
The indivisibility of the Republic is a fundamental rule. Tolerance will be zero tolerance: those who want to import into France sectarian tensions will find the republican State an obstacle in their path… Anti-Semitism and Islamophobic sentiments will be condemned with the same severity… As for those who might not be French but who would like to challenge these rules, no one is holding them back…
Here is my article on the riots throughout Europe. The photos are good, and there is a link to more photos. But you will see that the two videos—one on the destruction in Perpignan, the other on the Los Angeles riots where they shouted “Jews in the ovens” have both been deleted. Recently I learned that all pro-Israel videos have been banned from Daily Motion, so most of the videos I posted are no longer available.
More photos are here.
I don’t really know how many riots broke out, there were so many. They were all over the world. In Los Angeles they chanted “Put the Jews in ovens.” Similar things in Amsterdam. Many French shrug this off, because they don’t really care what happens to Jews, and they express outrage at the suffering of the poor Palestinians. However, in fairness, some French bloggers and many comments at the forums are pro-Israel.
Here is the point of view of French politician Robert Spieler, who wants nothing to do with conflicts that don’t concern France:
This conflict (meaning Gaza), which in no way concerns France or Europe, permits the partisans of foreign interests to import hatred and violence onto our soil. This causes one to reflect on the loyalty of certain persons to France or to Europe in the event of a conflict in which French interests are opposed to those of Israel or the Arab world.
The Israeli, Palestinian, Algerian, Turkish and Hamas flags must be banned from demonstrations that are now unfolding in France and the political leaders who represent us have no cause to meddle in this war….
The defense of our identities means, whether one wants it or not, the emergence of a powerful Europe liberated from its subjugation to a decadent American Empire and capable of resisting Asiatic powers and the Islamization of our continent: a military, diplomatic, and economic Europe, with Russia as its partner.
And here is a voice in the wilderness, Jean-Francois Touze who is pro-Israel. I’ve heard he has almost no following:
The NDR supports without reservations the offensive conducted by the State of Israel against Hamas. What is at stake, of course, is the security of Israelis who are victims of rocket and mortar attacks. And the security of Israel threatened with annihilation by the Hamas charter. And as it confronts Islamic terrorism, the entire West, out of fear for its own security, must claim its right and its duty to a legitimate response and to the justified use of force….
The extreme violence marking the anti-Israel demonstrations in Paris this Saturday show, as if it were necessary, that the scum (“racaille”) of the suburban ghettoes, along with certain Islamist agitators and the ultra-Left have indeed effectuated an ideological and activist juncture, all united in the same hatred of our Western society, of our democratic nations and, in the final analysis, of our way of life, hence of our civilization.
At a time when multiple threats against the West are visible and when the State of Israel is engaged in a just offensive, which for its citizens and their safety is a simple defensive action, and which, too, is a symbol of resistance to terrorism, the French ought to know that there is a veritable fifth column on our soil.
One blogger, Le Conservateur, was knocked off the web for a while by hackers. He said that he perceives in France a definitive hatred of Israel.
I think the French have become so self-defeating, so self-hating, and so insular that they really cannot see what is happening.
This has been a bad two weeks. I didn’t know what course to follow. I have been very critical of Jewish “collaboration,” but I have made it clear that I am for the IDF in their efforts all the way, and I hope they destroy Hamas. Just in numbers Jews can’t possibly be as responsible as others, but they are such a high-profile group, they seem to be everywhere. Did you know there are only 12,000 Jews in Spain, yet the Spanish have become very anti-Semitic!! I see that once there is rigid anti-Semitism, there is nothing you can do about it. One French blogger refused to believe there were only 500,000 Jews in France. She said there had to be more because they are so powerful. That old idea of a world-wide Jewish conspiracy is prevalent again. French bloggers often speak of the Washington-Tel-Aviv axis, a conspiratorial force whose purpose is to destroy the nations of Europe. But what can I say when it comes out that the U.S. and Israel are looking favorably on the entry of Turkey into Europe?
If you have any suggestions or comments, please let me know. Sorry to ramble on. Let me know if this e-mail satisfies your request, or if you would like me to rewrite it. It was done very hastily.
Here are dozens of amazing photos of what happened in Nice last Saturday:
And here is one video from Denmark that still works, with an English translation.
LA replies:
You write:
The crux of the problem is that the French Right perceives that French Jews advocate for France things that they would never advocate for Israel. Metissage, for example. They see that while the Jews in France seem to welcome a Muslim presence, they also display a strong patriotic sentiment for Israel, so they appear to be destroying France with one set of values on the one hand, and fighting for Israel using another set of values, on the other.
But these Jewish attitudes are not in contradiction with each other, if we understand where the Jews are coming from. The Jews are looking at the world through a liberal lens. They see themselves as a discriminated against minority group deserving of special protection, and they see the Muslims as a discriminated-against minority group deserving of special protection; and they think that the host society, the French (who are not a minority group deserving special protection, or any protection) should give way to and even merge with the Muslims. So the Muslims should be welcomed in France and encouraged to take over France, while the Jews should be protected from the Muslims in Israel. As outrageous as these two positions seem from the commonsense point of view, from the liberal point of view there is no contradiction between them.
As I argued recently, the way out of this liberal madness is through traditionalism. Instead of making the protection of minorities the primary thing, the protection of existing nations should be the primary thing. Meaning, if the Jews were protective of Israel as a nation that has the right to exist, and protective of France as a nation that has the right to exist, then they could take a consistent, non-contradictory position: insofar as Muslims threaten Israel, Muslims should be opposed; and insofar as Muslims threaten France, Muslims should be opposed. Furthermore, if the Jews adopted the national, traditionalist position I’ve described rather than the liberal, minority-centric position they now have, then they would stop supporting Muslims in France and the French would stop perceiving the Jews as a threat to France. Thus, through the embrace of traditionalism and the abandonment of minority-centric liberalism, Jews could greatly reduce the Jewish problem.
But as long as the liberal, pro-minority, anti-national thinking remains in place, you have the horrifying Sarkozy position, which you described thus:
“[Sarkozy] insists that anti-Semitism and Islamophobia will be punished with equal severity. His line is that of the EU—all discriminations are equally bad.”
About which you commented:
If there are no differences between behaviors, then self-defense and first-degree murder are identical. Self-preservation and racism are equally bad. The unjustifiable desire to eradicate Jews from the earth is equal to the justifiable urgency to stop Islamic immigration and the Islamization of France.
A final point: the moral insanity of saying that all discriminations are equally bad is not just the Sarkozy and EU position, it is the Norman Podhoretz position, as I discussed in my 2004 article, “Why Jews Welcome Muslims.”
Mark Jaws writes:
In an earlier email to you I confessed that even I, Mark Jaws—a staunch Zionist and a semi-Semite who grew up culturally Jewish—occasionally walk along the edges of the Anti-Semitic Lake and the behavior of French Jews illustrates why I have begun to dip my toes into that body of water.
“So the Muslims should be welcomed in France and encouraged to take over France, while the Jews should be protected from the Muslims in Israel. As outrageous as these two positions seem from the commonsense point of view, from the liberal point of view there is no contradiction between them.”
While you are to be commended for trying to explain the anti-white behavior of the liberal Jews, I believe the average, run of the mill Kevin McDonald type anti-Semite will see this as yet additional evidence that Lawrence Auster is an excuse monger for the Jewish Left who employs different standards when dealing with Israel.
LA replies:
If you have an argument to make about the Jews, make it, then others can read it and see if it is correct or not, and agree with it or dispute it. But I would advise against making statements like, “I have begun to dip my toes into that body of water.” That has a braggadocio quality to it, even a threatening ring. It suggests that you are embracing anti-Semitism. But the statement doesn’t contain any actual content so that people can know what this “toe-dipping” consists of.
I say this because anti-Semitism is not just a lake you can take a dip in, it is a ocean, and once a person enters it, once a person identifies himself with anti-Semitism, then the anti-Semitic worldview takes over his mind completely, and he is lost. So my recommendation is to stay away from imagery and keep to arguments.
Regarding the contradictory position of French Jews, on further thought I realize that before accepting that this is the case, we need quotations demonstrating that the same French Jewish individuals who support Muslim empowerment in France also support Israel against Muslims.
Mark Jaws replies:
I like metaphors, perhaps to a fault. But I view my sentiments against liberal Jews (hence, most Jews) differently than the rabid anti-Semitism which infests many others. For example, I often ask myself if the two thousand years of systematic persecution against Jews has permanently engrained in too many of our folk the view of “whites as cancer.” This is what I mean by dipping the toes in the water. I have these feelings and I am not afraid to admit having them. It has nothing to do with self-loathing but just a hostility to the ingratitude of today’s Jews living in the West.
LA replies:
I obviously have nothing against metaphors. But anti-Semitism is sui generis, a uniquely powerful psychological phenomenon that is dangerous to people’s reason. Unlike other subjects, it is not simply a set of assertions one can agree or disagree with, it is a total worldview that takes over a person completely once he has assented to it. And therefore I think it’s best to avoid the use of evocative metaphors such as “I’m dipping my toes in the water” to express one’s interest in Judeo-critical ideas, and instead stick with discursive statements that can either be supported or not.
Mark Jaws replies:
I am not sure I agree. One day I can just as easily defend the Jews and Israel, as the next day VEHEMENTLY attack LIBERAL Jews. I don’t know if anti-Semitism is unique (how does it differ from viewing blacks as inferior beings?), but I do know we Ashkenazis are a unique people with a unique history.
LA replies:
I don’t think It’s a good thing to indicate approval of anti-Semitism, as you did in your first comment. Sure, many people, including Jews, have negative feelings about Jews from time to time. And this could be called anti-Semitism. But serious anti-Semitism is something else. And the statement that one is dipping one’s toes in the waters of anti-Semitism conveys the idea, whether it was intended or not, that one is getting into serious anti-Semitism.
I’m surprised by your lack of understanding of the uniqueness of anti-Semitism. This is something I’ve discussed many times. There are many inter-group hostilities. With other hostilities, you don’t have this obsessive idea that a single disliked party is the source of all evils. No group has ever been demonized as the Jews are in the sacred writings of Islam and in Nazi and neo-Nazi writings. If the fact that much of the world is currently ganged up against the tiny country of Israel, sees it as the main cause of world tensions, and sides with those seeking to destroy it, does not demonstrate to you that there is something unusual about anti-Semitism, then nothing will.
Mark P. writes:
You wrote:
Regarding the contradictory position of French Jews [that what they want for Israel is different than what they want for France], on further thought I realize that before accepting that this is the case, we need quotations demonstrating that the same French Jewish individuals who support Muslim empowerment in France also support Israel against Muslims.
First, I don’t really think there is any contradiction. Jews want for Israel the same thing they want for France: outright liberalism in both cases. Just like in France, Israel’s population is becoming less European every day (the Ashkenazi Jews are 37 percent of the population and dropping.) They associate their safety with the progress of the liberal world view, not with having their own particular homeland defended. If it were true otherwise, why wouldn’t French Jews just leave and go to Israel?
You’re seeing this in all of Israel’s weak attempts to defend itself.
Second, I think you put it best in an article a while ago. There is nothing wrong with criticizing Jews as long as you don’t criticize Jews as Jews. Too much of Jewish criticzing boils down to treating Jews as viruses instead of moral actors making moral choices. That’s a losing proposition. Criticize those Jews for their actions and words but give them an out so they can repent their old ways.
LA replies:
In fact I have said numerous times that when Jews themselves declare that as Jews they are committed to pro-minority, pro-alien, anti-national policies, then it is justified to criticize Jews as Jews and call on them to stop advancing these offensive positions; and, if they don’t, to tell them that while their rights as individuals and as a minority group shall be protected, they do not have the right to be respected as national spokesmen and to pronounce on national questions.
Posted by Lawrence Auster at January 18, 2009 01:51 AM | Send
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